ottawa foodies

The strawberry margarita I had there was terrible. I realize that it isn't their specialty, but the syrup they use doesn't taste anything like strawberries. It was watery instead of being thick and slushy. The food isn't great and it bothers me that the waitresses at the Bayshore location are snotty and look like they should be working as strippers. Makes me wonder what their hiring policies are.

Response to canadian_momma... Wow.. looks like you managed to squeeze quite a lot of vitriol into a comment on their strawberry margarita's. I'll probably be the only one to point it out, but the snotty stripper comment was quite petty. You can wonder all you like about their hiring policies (or rather try to cast aspersions on them).. but it is quite simply obvious they hire young, attractive, probably inexperienced people (yes.. they have waiters too which you would know if you've ever been seated in the 'baby' section for lunch). If this were a crime, then half the restaraunt managers in the city would be in jail.

As for their crappy drinks, I've been quite happy with their cheap martinis.. and no.. I don't order the watery/fruity pap off the menu, I order (for the fantastic price of $4.27) my standard Vodka-Gin-Vermouth shaken martini. (pretty hard to screw that one up)

"...it is quite simply obvious they hire young, attractive..."

I mean this in the nicest way possible:

Dude, you're into trashy.

That's not "attractive" to many people. That's...well, it's a mystery to me what's going on with those outfits (and hair, and make-up). They DO look like strippers. It's bad enough that if I was new in town, I'd either go rushing in or keep away, thinking there was something more going on in the dark booths there.

This thread has officially been hijacked! I'd just like to mention, since we're on topic (in an off-topic kind of way) that an old acquaintance of mine from many years ago used to be a hostess at Moxie's. She then turned into an escort (yeah you read that right), which eventually paid her way through business school and now she's a marketing web rep for an IT firm. Where am I going with this? Oh yeah, I need a drink, I just remembered I dated her (before she was an escort).

They are not just "young and attractive", that is the norm at most (especially chain) restaurants. They are wearing extremely revealing outfits and tons of makeup. Many of them do look like strippers and quite frankly I find it very degrading. It's barely a step up from hooters but at least Hooters is up front about what they are REALLY selling.

This discussion is getting quite dramatic. I moved it out of the "Margaritas" section as it was off topic there.

I don't think it's fair at all to compare Moxie's with Hooters! I know of groups of women who love to get together at Moxie's. Some of the food at Moxie's is very decent for a chain; I understand this was not the case for Hooters.

As for the servers at Moxie's, it does seem that they are hired for having a certain attractiveness and they do tend to wear short skirts. That said, I can't remember ever seeing them act any less professionally than servers at other similar restaurants like Kelsey's or Milestones.

Disclaimer: I've only been to this location (Bayshore), and my last visit was over a year ago.

As I've said before, I've been to both locations and I must say, I only felt that the women were being paraded like meat at a butcher shop at the Gloucester location. I've been to the Bayshore location many times and have always been please with the quality of service and some great (food for a chain) and was never distracted by the level of reveal of dress.

I don't think it's fair to paint all locations with the same brush.

Fresh Foodie: I was not comparing the food to Hooter's, just the waitresses. The food at Moxie's isn't bad.

Tiana: I do agree that the Gloucester location was worse but I have still felt slightly uncomfortable at the Bayshore location at times. It is possible that because it is in a mall they need to tone it down more since they likely get more families coming in.

You guys are all very quick to judge, now don't you think? Have you ever thought about these girls themselves? A lot of the girls who work there are just trying to make a few dollars to pay their way through UNIVERSITY! Moxie's is by far one of the busiest restaurants in Ottawa. Working at a busy restaurant means that they can make more money in a shorter amount of time. These girls work crazy hard ... have you seen them running up and down those stairs a million times a day? And obviously the hiring policy is working, because it is super busy (like wait list busy) ever night AND DAY of the week! what other restaurant can say they hit a wait list every day? The girls at moxie's have given me the best service I have ever received. apparently, they go through over a month of solid training just to be allowed to serve. If you dont like the skirts, the entire TWO lower levels have girls and guys in pants and long sleeve shirts (which, by the way, youve all forgot to mention!)

So you're saying that it's acceptable for society to demand that university students must be sexually exploited to make money? I've never been there, but puh-lease. What kind of message does that send to young girls? If you want to make top dollar you have to show a little skin? Why can't women make great tips from providing great service and not have to take their clothes off??? If management were really concerned with them being able to "make a few dollars" they would pay them a higher wage and allow a more respectful uniform. In my opinion, as a foodie, I'm far more interested in a restaurant that is "super busy" because the food is fantastic, not because it is packed with men who want to see teenagers in short skirts.

the fact of the matter is that all the servers at moxie's do give great service. and the food is awesome for the price. and again, if you dont like the uniforms in the lounge, you can sit in the dining room, get the same great service, with servers wearing pants and long shirts. no one forces these girls to work at moxie's. they choose to because it (looks) like a fun place to work. Ive never seen sleezy-looking men in there when ive gone to eat. It seems like regular business men and couples and families. plus, the lounge is 19+. If youre over 19, you should have the mental capacity to be able to decide whether to sit upstairs or downstairs. choose the former if these girls make you uncomfortable. I feel sorry for any of the employees that serve there if they are reading this. I also feel sorry for anyone who is so self-conscious that they cant appreciate moxie's for what it is ...good service, great food, and pretty girls. these girls arent sexually exploited. they choose to do this. relax a little everyone.

Hmm... I wasn't aware that the Moxie's at Bayshore has an upper and lower level, much less a 19+ lounge. I'll have to pop in sometime and see how they managed to squeeze all that in to their little cubby off the mall.

Fresh Foodie - I think most of these comments are referring to the Gloucester location. The Bayshore location is far ahem...tamer...if you could call it that. Either way you slice it, the food is uninspiring (but my experiences are quite limited with both locations)

Wow, this thread is so compelling that, being a West End girl, I went to Moxie's (Bayshore) for dinner last night! After telling my boyfriend about how heated this thread is becoming, he couldn't resist the opportunity to be served by a potentially scantily-clad young thing. However, he was slightly disappointed when our waitress, Jenna, was not half-naked. A bit of cleavage and some knee-high boots, but nothing obscene. The waitresses were clad in scoop-neck t-shirts and capris and boots! Having only been to the Bayshore location once, I would have to believe Monty when he says that the comments likely refer to the Gloucester location.

Service was good and Jenna was quite knowledgable, making recommendations about our orders. The food was good for a chain restaurant. The "med bread" appie (baked flatbread with a trio of dips) was quite tasty and I would definitely order it on my next visit. The portion was generous enough for my boyfriend and myself to share, too. And I can't complain that the Shanghai Noodle dish I ordered prepared hot was actually spicy enough for my heat-seeking tastebuds. The chocolate cherry bread pudding for dessert was actually really, really good and quite rich. I didn't leave disappointed.

Am I rushing back for the food, atmosphere or service? No. But it wasn't half bad and really and truly, even my judgy-judgy prudish self didn't find the waitresses too sexy.

So soccer player you are saying that because I don't like to see women exploited I am now self conscious? Which I can only assume you mean that I feel "threatened" by these girls in some way. Hardly the case, I just don't feel that it is necessary. If a restaurant has good food and good service, why the need to add that extra "marketing" into the mix? Milestones is pretty similar in food and service and they are extremely busy as well but the servers dress conservatively. Also I am not sure what you are talking about but I have never even been in the lounge. I have only been seated in the dining room and have seen the same type of dress. This has nothing to do with the girls that work there, they are just trying to make a buck and I don't blame them for it. While it wouldn't be my choice for a place of employment I hold nothing against someone who chooses it. My problem is with the company itself and the fact that their hiring policy includes only a "certain type" of person and then asks them to parade around like meat.

FYI, in the near future I'm going to move several of the comments here over to the Gloucester location of Moxie's. I don't believe any of these complaints apply to the Bayshore location.

In the meantime, I'd like to make two points:

1. There are three separate entries for Moxie's on this site ("See also:" section above). I only create separate entries for chains when there's some notable difference between locations. Why this discussion took place in the least appropriate entry I cannot say. Murphy's law I guess.

2. This is OttawaFoodies. We're only mildly interested in atmosphere (including our server's state of undress), but very interested in food. :-)

I created this forum topic to contain the heated Moxie's discussions. :)

They are no longer in the Comments/Buzz section.

One thing that I just don't get but haven't said anything since it was in "buzz" - if MelodySoul doesn't like this place, why does she keep going there? It certainly sounds that way at least.

I have to admit I've never been there, but I will also admit I used to love going to Hooters in Bells Corners when I used to work right next door. I'd go 2 or 3 times a month. The beer sucked, but the food was good enough for that type of food, and it was nice to sit down the odd time after work and be waited on by attractive women. There, I've said it. Big deal. I'm a man and I like looking at women - I'd say that pretty-much makes me a normal human being. I don't want to live in a world where men aren't allowed to look at women, nor women at men - that happens too you know, and I'm sure there are plenty of women in town who wish there were a place like this with hunky men serving them.

Speaking of which, my wife used to like going to Hooters with me too (the Buffalo Chicken burgers were actually VERY good), and she knew I used to like to look at the women for that matter. Hey, it's OK to window shop as long as you don't buy anything. She does her share of window-shopping too. It's all good - that makes us normal human beings and makes for a healthy relationship since we don't feel a need to hide normal human feelings from each other.

As I mentioned before, this thread has been hijacked. I mean, people have to pay bills. They choose to work at Moxie's instead of, well, any other restaurant. My ex who worked at a Moxie's had nothing bad to say about it. She was treated fairly, and she could choose to wear a skirt or slacks. She chose to wear the skirt. This is all getting beside the point though. I mean, it is a bit poignant however, since the food is rather unremarkable, so I guess it's natural to talk about... well... everything but the food?! ;) It is a restaurant that tries to be all things to all people, from steaks to chinese stir fry, to burgers to Moxie-sized martinis... in so doing, everything is rather unremarkable or memorable in the handful of times I've been to a variety of Moxie's locations around Ontario. Except for the drinks. I liked my drinks. Especially that bellini... mmm... short skirts... err... bellini!

I am surprised that no one has mentioned the fact that when you go out to a bar, it is not unusual for female bartenders to be scantily clad - almost scandalously so!


In defense of Hooters: I once went to their location in the market with half a dozen girlfriends because we couldn't get a table anywhere else to watch the playoffs. The waitresses were extremely efficient and friendly and even joked with us about telling the men working in the kitchen that we were a table exclusively made up of women (as opposed to the usual gang of men).



I am interested in going to Moxie's - but not to look at the waitresses - because the "big deal" there appears to be the bellini! yum!

I'm not that concerned about the appearance of the waitresses (especially since I'm not attracted to women in that sense). I only expect efficient service. If someone wants to wear revealing clothing, that's her (or his) preogative. I don't tip extra because of it, I can honestly say.

Every time I've been to the Gloucester location, I've been disappointed.

The food was either over or under seasoned severely, not just mildly. I have never been impresssed at all with the food I've ordered for various reasons (as far as quality and taste are concerned).

I also have a few food alergies and sensitivies and I found that they're not very accommodating since their food is very pre-made. I always end up having to order a bunch of side dishes to piece them together as a meal (very expensive that way).

Maybe this was coincidence but I've never been impressed with their service. I've often had to wait more than 30 minutes to have drinks refilled or to have the "quality control check" for condiments, desserts or whatnot.

Again, maybe I just went on off nights but I do expect restaurants to properly staff their dining rooms so patrons aren't waiting long times for service.

As for the waitress' appearance, I must say this: all my jock buddies go to the Gloucester Moxie's on a frequent basis only because of the done up girls. They don't care about the food as they mostly just drink and have appetizers. I'm sure there are other customers like that.

Holy moly ottawa_adam - dude - if you are getting such crappy service what the heck do you keep going back for (if not the sexy ladies, which you claim not to be the case) :-)

We go to Moxie's in Gloucester about 4-5 times a year. I think its reasonably priced and the food is pretty good. Service is ok. Its nothing special but I will say we always get the thank-you from the hostesses on the way out of the restaurant and frequently the door has been held open for us coming and going. Those things are not huge but I certainly appreciate it. I should add that I have been surprised how the "thanks and have good night" salutation does not happen when you are leaving.

Certainly its true that there are many beautiful women there. As a man, I must admit this has not been a problem for me.

However, I have always gone with my gf and often at her suggestion so that is not why were going.

If you don't feel like cooking, and you want to go out for a reasonably priced meal that is reasonably good, I would recommend it.

Cheers

zymurgist - while I know that I'm new here and I don't want to create waves since I like this forum so far, I feel that I should not have to explain myself to you. When I said that I'm not attracted to women, I meant that. Sexy ladies don't do anything for me. I was just trying to offer my opinion on the place. Maybe I did so in the wrong manner?

As for returning to the restaurant, when I go out dining with friends, we take turns choosing the venue, so I may not have input into where we go. Groups don't always agree on where to go ;)

Sorry ottawa_adam, it was just gentle ribbing - nothing meant by it other than that. My apologies.

No worries. Like I said, I'm still new here and just learning the different personalities. I've read quite a few of your posts and I do note that you have a lot of constructive things to say here. :)

zymurgist I don't keep going back, I haven't been to either location in over a year. Before that I did give it a few tries though and the food isn't bad but my husband doesn't enjoy the menu much which is part of the reason we haven't returned. I don't think there is anything wrong with men wanting to look at attractive women but at the same time I don't have any desire to see women in skimpy outfits and yes I do sometimes find it offensive. Bartenders and servers in bars don't bother me at all because it's a different atmosphere and is expected really.

I've eaten at Moxie's at Bayshore many times and have always enjoyed their food and the service has been wonderful. The women (and men) who serve and host are always very well groomed and look awesome... (I wish I still looked so hot!) I have never been offended by the way they are dressed, in fact I think they all look super (I think my husband would concur ;-) oohhh.... Love their Avacado spring rolls!!! not to mention that they serve a pretty good Eggs Benedict.

This topic is hilarious. Thanks for the laughs. I suppose I should put in my two cents as well.
I'll admit it I have eaten at a moxies, ONCE:( Before going to the movies at the gloucester location. I was surprised at the decor, looked very nice & cozy in my opinion for a chain restaurant. The staff I do remember being dressed a little too 'saucy' for such a place but hey if your young, have it going on & need money that is one way to make it.
Didn't drink margarita's, which I think is where this whole topic was started, but was surprised at how expensive box restaurant food is??? Could have dined at the Wellington for almost the same price and had a much nicer wine & quality food!
It was a last minute hunger before the show, that is my excuse. And guess what it was a Tuesday night, lol!!! (if you have read ottawa city mag's top ten article you might find that comment amusing, lol)

Ok so I have thought about this topic a lot and wondered if maybe I was too quick to judge. We tried the Gloucester location again tonight and I have to say it was very different from our previous experiences. I saw one girl who was in a very revealing outfit but I think she was serving in the lounge. All the other servers I saw were in pants and long sleeved tops (maybe because it's cold out now or maybe they have changed policy I'm not sure). Anyway the food was actually good, in fact the chicken tandoori pizza was amazing. I guess I'll be coming back as long as I continue to have good experiences like this one. Like I said before it had been over a year since I had visited either location so a lot can change in a year.

But MelodySoul, without your fire adding to the controversy and salaciousness (is that a word?) of this thread.. it might just drift into obscurity... ;-)

I haven't been to Moxie's in awhile, but everytime I have been there, I didn't think that the end of the world depended on how much clothing the servers were wearing! I only once found that a female server there was showing a bit too much. Everyone arguing or debating here needs to give their heads a shake and worry about something more then clothing on servers. How about we start with the kids at home with no parents raising them, or even better, feeding them proper food!!! This site is about food, nothing else. I have worked in the industry for 20 years, and have seen alot in that time. No one is ever asked to let it all hang out, and if they were and did not want to, that individual certainly has the choice if they want to work in any certain establishment! Watch all the little teenagers walking down the street and let's worry about how little they wear, not a server in decent work attire. Bon Appetit!

I somehow totally missed this topic in the past.

Boy am I out of the loop in more than one way...

First off I've ONLY ever been to the Bayshore location. And absolutely nothing about the place upset me in anyway. The service is fast and friendly, and I can't recall what anyone was wearing, so I would say it didn't stand out in any way (positive or negative). For me, Moxie's is a usual stop during my Christmas Shopping to SIT and grab a bite to eat in a comfortable atmosphere with friendly service and good food (vs the Food Court). My experience has been that they have great salads and martinis.

And as Fresh Foodie said, sometimes it's just about the food!

FunCookin - you have to admit your post is kind of hipocritical. You are scolding those who are continuing to argue about this topic and not talking about food.....by continuing the argument and not commenting at all on the food. I agree that this thread is pretty tired, however the last post on the subject in this forum was on November 12 2007 (yes I realize that there were more recent posts on the actual restaurant's page, however you chose to ALSO post your opinion on this forum and resurect the thread). The way to end an argument is to let it die, not stir it up again by passionatly declaring that your opinion is right and anyone who disagrees is wrong.

I disagree... er I mean I concur... er...

I agree we should not have started kicking this horse again :-) But honestly, it's bound to happen in some threads when someone new comes along. So in the same breath I say "welcome FunCookin"

I disagree that this site is only for talking about food in and of itself.

In fact, I believe the reason FF created these very forums was for free discussion of food-related matters, not just food. We talk about the best frying pans - and that's not talking about food. But it is food-related. Talking about problems/issues within the food industry is IMO fair game. Scantily clad waitresses IMO falls into this category.

Pete - HAHA I almost died laughing at that

"Talking about problems/issues within the food industry is IMO fair game. Scantily clad waitresses IMO falls into this category."

Does that mean you think a Scantily clad waitress is a problem/issue ?

For some, this is a topic ..... but a problem/issue ? .... no.

Sure, "topic" is probably a better word.

To be honest, and going WAY back to the 'sexyness' of the servers...
I used to be a server at Moxies, bayshore. (or Baywhore, as we call it)
The hiring process it BRUTAL! I would honestly say it's harder to be a waitress at Moxies than at Hooters. The boss there was very... I don't know how to say it nicely? Basically if you didn't dress a certain way, or look a certain way, or act a certain way, you wouldn't move up, you wouldn't get shifts, etc. As a university student, the tips for being a bus girl, or greet, weren't that good. Waitress is where you needed to be.
I guess it is exploitation.
But as a young, cute university student with not a lot of other job experience, what else can I offer?
Sex sells. Especially when the average person sitting down is probably under 30 (at least in my section! haha)

I never looked down on the job. A job is a job is a job. I'd rather serve people advertising my attractive side than a lot of other student jobs out there. I guess it becomes ingrained too... the 'sexier' you dress, the more tips you get. You pick it up subconsciously in the end.

Captain Caper said: "Does that mean you think a Scantily clad waitress is a problem/issue ?"


Uhhhhhhh.... yeah. Actually, if we're talking about food and the enjoyment thereof, yes. Scantily clad women are there to sell something--viz., themselves. Often enough, scantily clad waitresses sell food that could not sell on its own (or themselves in replacement thereof.) And by "often enough" I mean "almost always".

For instance, I was at Domus the other night (for the first time), and noticed that:

a.)they were very fully clothed
b.)they were very knowledgeable of the product
c.)the food was (very) good.

This, I believe, with the exercise of very little common sense, was no coincidence. And, thus, the problem of scantily clad women is that the food will often enough be of low quality. And, as such, pertains to the discussion of food and food merchants.

Oh come on tedj. Who wouldn't agree that stuffy Domus would only be improved by adding some legs or cleavage (or in the case of male staff.. washboard abs?) to the product knowledgability, and food quality? Last time I was at Juniper for lunch there was a very attractive hostess there, and although I don't think there was a lot of skin, I wouldn't call her attire 'fully clothed'. Jesting aside, I think it is absurd to argue that a restaraunt's business is food. Loblaws business is food, a restaraunt's business is entertainment, primarily through satisfying a customers base desire for sustenance, and slightly less base desire for pleasure. If this wasn't the case, Domus, for example wouldn't be spending so much time stacking the tuna 'just so' on the vegetables, or arranging the julienned food in fanciful ways. Might as well suggest the food at all restaraunts should just be scooped with a big spoon and unceremoniously slapped on a plate, as say that the decor of the establishment, or yes, even the attractiveness or state of dress (undress?) of the staff does not, or should not matter....

I would also like to point out that the resurrection of this forum is SO NOT MY FAULT! ;-)

Anybody know of any restaurants in town that have 'Serving Wenches' (circa 1755) ??

That's traditional German garb (amongst others, I'm sure). Lindenhof used to but apparently does not anymore at their new location

CaptainC - Ah yes the Wenches... it was just a matter of time, until this topic turned in that direction!

I don't know of any in Ottawa, but at one time Montreal was a Wench-Meca. Lets see... there were:

Le Festin Du Gouverneur at the Fort on Ste Helene's Island. This is an interactive dinner theatre with guys and gals dressed in the attire of 17th Century Montreal. If I remember right lots of hand-to-mouth action here (as they don't give out utensils) and oh ya lots of ALE. Very popular with the tourists since 1973.

Old Munich - Unfortunately this is a Montreal institution that is now closed. It was just off Henri-Bourassa and was basically a HUGE Beer Hall that served German-like fare and lots of BEER. And oh ya the gals were Bavarian Beauties!

Maidenhead Pub - Once upon a time the only pub in the Alexis Neon Plaza across Atwater from the Montreal Forum. Basically a "Pirate" themed place. Now if someone wants to talk about a waitress uniform with very very little fabric and lots of skin this was it. The gals wore puffy white shirts that "clung" to their assets, their waists were cinched in with a type of corset, and they wore tight black shorts with these strange frills on the backside. The outfit was finished off with black fishnet stockings and high heels. And this ladies and gents was the 70s. You'd have to see it to believe it, but alas it is no more (believe it failed when the Forum closed and the action moved down the street to the Molson / Bell Centre).

Anybody heading for Montreal this weekend ?

I had posted originally in the food review of Moxie's and only pasted it over on this forum. My bad for not changing a few lines in it. As for food reviews, that is all people should talk about in my mind, like how was the servers knowledge of the food and drinks, was the food good, stuff like that. And in the forums, go crazy, the floor is open for sure. I just always get a kick out of how people get all riled up about how others dress albeit in the workplace or on the street. I agree that it should be tasteful. I work with a girl who we have to constantly keep telling to put her cleavage away cause it really is hanging out and is unprofessional. But at a place like Moxie's, I have only seen one girl do this in the 4 or 5 times I have been there.

As for the food at Moxie's, we have only ever tried out the appetizers and some funky drinks, and for the most part it has been alright.

Sadie everything you described in your post is exactly why I had a problem with Moxies. However my last few visits have thankfully included tastefully dressed servers who were friendly and fairly knowledgeable as well. We'll see what it's like when summer rolls around.

Sex sells, if it is in your face or subliminal. Hooter's is in your face, Moxie's seems to be much less in your face. Everywhere we turn, any business will use sexiness in ads, commercials, posters, etc to make more money then the next guy. Go to Hooter's, it is only men in there, go to Moxie's and it is quite a mix of men and women. I also can't remember the last time I saw a lingerie ad selling its stuff with someone who wasn't in shape. Look how well Victora Secret does every year. From past experiences and encounters in my life, people who aren't comfy in their own skin or happy about their own looks are the ones who pipe up about others not wearing enough, funny how that works isnt it?

That is the second time in this thread that someone has mentioned that they think the people who do not enjoy the scantily clad wait-staff are insecure with themselves. I find this disrespectful and emplore future posters to avoid this. It insinuates that just because someone has a differing opinion than yours, there must be something WRONG with them. There is nothng phsycologically wrong with people who have a differing opinion on a) appropriate dress b) the issue of exploitation of women; they simply do not share your opinion. How would you feel if someone posted that in thier experience, people who like scanitly clad wait-staff are heathens, totally promiscuous, and desperately subservient to men?- doesn't feel so good to have people tell you there is something wrong with you just cause you don't agree with them eh?

Not that they are insecure totally with just themselves, but the human body all in all. Like some people like hairy chested men, or some people like bald men. Who knows what makes em tick. But as to why people think girls dressed in skirts and tops is exploiting them, do tell? And who ever said they were promiscuous or subservient to men? Just cause they are for the most part 'attractive' you perceive that they must be coherced into wearing certain attire? Im sure if you watched them leave from work, they would be wearing about the same amount of clothing.

So everyone has their opinion of course, but why do people go there if they think the women are prancing aroud naked and they don't think it is right? Have you for one second thought that those girls that work there actually enjoy being dressed like that? Obviously a good portion of them do or they would never work there. I do wonder why anyone really hates what the people at Moxie's wear though? They seriously are wearing plenty of clothing, someone should go in an take pics to back up the issue of what they wear! Like I said before, I have been there a handful of times, and all the servers, except for one girl showing a bit too much cleavage, seemed very professional and focused on their jobs. Once we wondered how they cut the garnish for a couple dishes and the waitress went out of her way to go get the item from the kitchen to show us and asked the kitchen manager where they bought it.

I wonder what Food is Hot is trying to convey in her profile picture here? Any takers? :-) Do the Moxie's servers wear shoulderless tops at work?

ps. just bugging you Food is Hot, love the reactions and it beats doing this then running around in the snowbanks!

Whoa... that's quite the tongue lashing FiH. I agree that FunCookin crossed the line with personal insult, although, actaully just the last sentence of the post. Don't we think we can just slap on the wrist and ignore? If you go far enough up this thread, MSoul basically said that anyone who dressed like that must (or should be?) a stripper.. which was I think was at least as insulting as as Cookin's comment, but I don't see her getting the short end of your temper. I think both sides have strayed slightly from the 'I don't approve of that lifestyle/choice/behaviour and that bothers me' to 'that person or group of people are stupid/dumb/ugly/slutty' whathaveyou. FunCookin,.. you could apologise for letting your point get personal, as could you MSoul.. and nobody is trying to say you are wrong for having your opinions. And FiH... for the love of all that's good, don't let FunCookin's pokes convince you to change your profile picture ;-)

Speaking of sluts and the last sentence of someone's post ... oh Pete! :-)

For Pete's Sake (pun intended) and the fact that I am now officially an Ottawa Foodie Site slut (as in the kind that is promiscuous with the amount of time I spend here)... can we just get back to the way things were before this thread took a down turn.

Not only that, but I've spent too much time reading this post and all it's replies!

Here's an idea... we could talk about FOOD, and not what everyone is wearing.

Unless of course someone wants to start a thread about that show "Barely Cooking", then you might be able to convince me that the two topics can be discussed as one.

;-P

I'm only poking fun, I think her picture is a good picture.

Lol, as far as my own picture in relation to this particular argument - I've never actually taken sides on this issue; just played devil's advocate on this thread. I actually completely see the point of both side A and side B and think both are totally valid, so I don't feel like a hipocrite for having the picture I do :)

I dont think anyone said you were a hypocrit, lol.

I am in no way uncomfortable with the human body, I am uncomfortable with how we sexualize it constantly in North America. Do I have some insecurities about my own body? Of course, I think we all do. It is really not related to my feelings on this topic though...believe it or not.

Edited to add:

I was one of several to make the stripper comment and in fact what I said is that I have seen some waitresses that looked like strippers, not that anyone dressed like that must or should be a stripper. Although it's been quite a long time since I have seen anything like that, I stand by it. I think there is a time and place for that kind of dress (nightclubs for instance) I just didn't think that it was appropriate in that setting. It was in no way a personal attack on anyone. I never had an issue with the waitresses themselves but with Moxie's policies.

Just to be clear... FiH is not changing her picture, right? ;-)

My boyfriend and I are reading through this and laughing. I'd say the Bayshore Moxies has sleazier looking girls than the Gloucester location. By a long shot. I've gone with both my guy and my mum - both noted the sleaze factor. The skirts are so short that one bend and it's reveal time.
I've never had trouble with snobs though. The girls have always been friendly though service is hit and miss. I just really wish it wasn't so stripper-ish.

It's shame as the chocolate mousse is so good.

I went to Moxie's in Kanata last month. Place was all packed and as soon as I entered the restaurant, I noticed that waitresses had cirtain dress code. They all looked same, thin and blonde, lots make up on, worn black mini skirts and tight shirts,they all looked like Barbie doll. But I didn't find these girls as stripper or sexually exploited at all, I understood their style as fashion.

I don't mean to offend Ottawan...But I find Ottawa is way too behind when it comes to fashion. Ottawa is wonderful city, so beautiful, safe, multi cultual and diversified, people are so friendly and so kind compare to any another big city, and most of people are ethically and politically correct.
However, I found Ottawa is somewhat consevative, uptight and boring, lack of appreciation and interest in fashion. For example, it is so hard to find nice and sexy pair of shoes. If I find something somewhat I like, it is ususally way over priced. I am so sick and tired of looking for clothes for my age, most of the store are for teen's and older women. Different shopping mall, same stores.
But things are changing, Coach has opend, huge success, Zara will open soon. H&M and Abercrombie & Fitch will open someday.
There is no surprise for me that some venders present fashion and style in their restaulants. But, to me, Moxie's is not edgy at all. I have seen many extremes in Tokyo.
Fashion is for every one to enjoy being yourself regardless of age, gender, race, size, religion. If you are offended by someone's fashion style, then there is something wrong with that fashion or you have certain prejudice, projecting your inferior complex, insecuritiy...etc etc.

I just wonder, Will Moxie's hire non-Barbie looking girl look like me, short and black hair asian woman in her 30's? or person over 40? who's size is 16? or who wear hijabs?

This is a cafe in Tokyo, all the waitresses are plus sized. So popular.

LOL, for all the Regulars...

"oh goody the Moxie topic (again)."

;-)

This topic has quite "long legs" and a lot of "moxie" doesn't it...

Aisu Kurimu - You make very interesting points. Agree Ottawa is very conservative... partly due to the Federal Government and the "protocol" aspect that seems to resonate because of that. When one is hosting folks from all around the world it seems to be easiest not to offend to stick with the tried and true... I know when I worked for various places here in Ottawa in the early 80s (including the Feds) that there was a strict dress-code. Places would hire you and give you a welcome package and there was always a dress code mentioned (including hi-tech which was supposed to be more laid-back). I even worked for one employer who frowned upon women wearing pants (skirts or dresses for the office only), guys had to have a Jacket (available at all times so they could meet clients, go to meetings etc) and ties were mandatory. And this wasn't a Law Firm, Bank or Accounting Agency, or any of the expected "uptights". Of course we can laugh about that now... but at the time it was a very desirable place to work (READ Great Salary) so folks just went along with it.

Things didn't seem to change much until the late 1990s... and even then they were behind the times... Had a boss around 1997 who absolutely wouldn't let us wear jeans on Casual Fridays... although every other Department did so. I am not talking ripped jeans, I'm referring to nice looking denim. They even had a fit when our office was "relocated" and several of us wore jeans because we were doing the Packing (sitting on the floor), and some of the Moving & Lifting. Ridiculous policy.

Food and Think

Thank you for your reply, your experience is quite interesting.
In my country, many of companies have rules for women, even office workers have to wear uniform!!! (Shown something ugly as picture.)
I worn uniform all my school days,kindergarten, primary school high school and even university !! I had to wear uniform!! I suffered from identity crisis because of this.
Now I really appreciate my free to choose what I wear.
Soon I have to go back to uniform(chef's jacket) but I am so proud of myself this time.

Oops, I guess there was "something" about this topic...I found this because I went to Moxie's last month and I wondered what other foodies thought about this place.
Weitresses were dressing sexier than any other places, and I also found customers...especially young girls dressed up very very sexy, much sexier than weitresses!! Most of them were having girls night out, and seemd they were having very good time.

Never been to Moxie's but if anyone goes to Crazy Horse in the future I'd be interested to hear comments on the micro mini's worn there.

Ken - do you mean Crazy Horse on March Rd? Its been burned down for years - doubt you'd find any mini's there except for the squirrels.

I went to moxies at Ogilvie, and some of the waitress were quite pretty, but I wouldn't say too provocatively dressed. The problem there, is the service was slow, so much so we had to leave, as it was a lunchtime, and I didn't get to try their food.

Ottawa is a beautiful city, but very conservative, perhaps even a bit boring, place, and doesn't have the feel or energy of a world city either. Rome, NY, London, Montreal - they have it, but usually Ottawa doesn't.

I rode my bike around downtown for a couple of hours on Sunday evening not long ago and it was so deserted. But if you park on Somerset near Bronson any evening and watch people go by, chatting, interacting and sometimes even arguing, you get more of a sense that there is some life around you. I sat on the patio at the bubble tea shop. They should do more patios in Chinatown - you can watch people, not just traffic - and it's not boring at all.

BEAVIS: How come, like, some stuff sucks, but then, like, some stuff is pretty cool?

BUTT-HEAD: Uhhh, well, if nothing sucked, and everything was cool all the time, then, like, how would you know it was cool?

BEAVIS: I would know. You just said, everything would be cool.

BUTT-HEAD: NO, buttmunch. I mean like, let's say someone came up and just hit you upside the head? Well, that would be cool.

BEAVIS: No it wouldn't. That would suck.

BUTT-HEAD: Yeah.... [hits Beavis repeatedly]

I was at Moxie's on Ogilvie last night before a movie. The food was good and the price of wine and selection great. We were seated upstairs in the "lounge" and I never really care how are servers are dressed; As long as they are clean looking and provide good service. However I found it to be over the top at this location, some of them look underage, and I actually saw part of our servers underwear as she walked away. That is how short her black dress was and was "ridding up" as she walked. THAT disturbs me. I'm sure she makes amazing tips though ;-)

LOL, I hadn't seen this topic when it did the rounds previously, so I was trying to catch up on the history. Based on the raised eyebrow of disapproval & comments from Mrs Rat that I was even reading about going to Moxie's tells me 3 things :

(a) Whether justified or not, Moxie's certainly has a reputation.
(b) We won't be dining there anytime soon (despite the fact this is exactly the kind of place my wife & I would have gone to if we were 20 years yonger).
(c) We have indeed turned into our parents and everthing we vowed we wouldn't.

Sourdough check out the new Crazy Horse 115 Roland Michener Drive. It's Tex Mex meets Cordon Bleu with an actual chef in the kitchen.
www.thecrazyhorse.ca/

Like the look of the menu. hope it tastes as good as it sounds. will have to give it a try this weekend after the movies.

ollie ...

nice comment ...

Poutine - So... did you deduct tip points, or add tip points when the time came for you to pay? ;-)

Poutine - So... did you deduct tip points, or add tip points when the time came for you to pay? ;-)

Because we all know what Pete did...

Perhaps surprisingly to you LwB, my tip levels are pretty consistent with service, and it is the exception, and not the rule that a server gets significantly more than the norm. I guess I asked for that comment though.. have to learn to keep my fingers silent...

LOL Oh....Pete. I left it up to my hubby to pay the bill. He did leave around 15% I believe....I would have left the same too. Surprisingly, service was in fact very good and so was the food... I will just make sure that my daughter NEVER works there.

Time to stir the pot . . . .:-)

Court case in BC over restaurant asking waitresses to dress "sexy"

www.theprovince.com

Just wanted to add no one is forcing those waitresses to work there.
they could go work at mcdonalds and not get tips.

Also most exotic dancers or "strippers" in Canada are not forced to work there and do so in their own will.
I know this because one girl that I was best friends with until a few years ago-she worked as a stripped for 5 years (then had a kid with a customer....whole nother story,lol).

There's a new Moxie's opening up soon on Hunt CLub and Riverside. It's an eye-opener that's for sure! There's a dining room for families with kids and there's the adult-oriented section presumably with a fantastic looking bar like the Kanata one to another side. Eventhough the girls appear like models and borderlining on a stripper's physique, we did get really good service. There are hits and misses with the food. But let me tell you oh that brownie and ice cream desert and their cocktails are so good for girls night out!!!

XOXOXO KC

So an interesting article on Canoe pertaining, in part, to Moxie's hiring strategy which would confirm what many of us expected.

lifewise.canoe.ca

For there to be anything legally wrong with this approach, "ugliness" would need to be labelled as a disability, and that would open up a huge can of worms. A person's level of attractiveness is at least partly in the eye of the beholder and it would be difficult to quantify in a legal sense.

Is it wrong to hire fashion models based on their appearance? What about actors, TV show hosts, receptionists, servers, tour guides, teachers, plumbers, engineers, telemarketers? It's a big continuum, and servers are more like actors than plumbers. ;-)

The serious problem I see from that article is the degrading terminology that is purportedly used by some within the industry.

FF, great post...

I see nothing wrong with their hiring policies & they do hire male servers.

My first experience with Moxies was in Bayshore while I was Xmas shopping a few years back, a buddy & I went in to have an early dinner & get out of the crowd.

Of course there were beautiful young ladies hovering around everywhere & my server`s name was 'JEOFF'!

They do a lot for charity, they really care about their staff & are treated with respect. A friend of mine`s daughter works at Moxies in Victoria, she was diagnosed with a debilitating disease. In B.C. they couldn`t perform a medical treatment so she had to go to California for at least 3 months & the Moxies Corporation contributed $ 5000 towards her costs & the Moxies in Victoria did a fundraising to get her more as well as contributing to the cause as well...

My problem with their hiring practice is this:

"Darren Hawker, 40, a former assistant general manager at Yorkdale Moxie's Classic Grill in Toronto, said he was directed by upper management to hire busty and thin applicants, regardless of whether or not they were qualified."

A server who is competent at his or her job is way more important to me than what he or she looks like. I understand that people who go to Moxie's for the eye candy aren't going to care but as an industry trend this is pretty sad.

Moxie's may do a lot for charity but not, apparently, if you're ugly. How much consideration for one's attractiveness goes into your hiring policy Terry?

Is "Darren Hawker" speaking on behalf of Moxies or is this mainly his opinion?
It kind of sounds like the article is just about him and he is a FORMER EMPLOYEE.

So not really going to read into that too much.

But in general it does seem that organizations and groups will put more nice looking or sociable people in the public or jobs with more visibility.

I know a few years ago I volunteered for the Diabetes foundation and a few people were asked to do fundraising for a raffle when there was some event at Lansdowne Park (this was a few years ago), and when I went to the place where we were supposed to sell raffle tickets it seemed they had kind of picked more younger nicer looking people and there wasn't too many people over 30 years old volunteering (it was mostly girls/women that were youngish...).

Also maybe in a lot of bar and restaurant jobs it is more friendly people who apply and people who already know they need to have a nice appearance and other people might not apply as much??

'Moxie's may do a lot for charity but not, apparently, if you're ugly. How much consideration for one's attractiveness goes into your hiring policy Terry?'

Who doesn't consider looks?

Of course I look at appearance; they'll be representing my establishment. It's hard to get mad at a smile, even harder if it's attractive!

Look whether you like it or not good looking people have an advantage in life...

Do you think it’s fair that as a unilingual individual I wouldn't be considered for a position in a number of restaurants in the Ottawa area...I don't like it but I certainly understand the merits of a bilingual staff?

If you're going to say that I can always learn another language well a large person can always lose weight, people can get a manicure, get their hair done, etc etc...

What constitutes 'ugly', if you apply @ Moxies & don't get hired are you ugly or are they just fully staffed, they hire male servers, they have a reputation, so does the Keg, so does local hero's & so on...

If a restaurant's hiring priorities include selecting young women who are thin and busty over experienced servers, I guess patrons can expect that the view might be better than the service and/or food.

Actually they would hire an attrative person with experience rather than someone without.

Moxies has a great training program, the less experienced start as Hostess's & work their way up...

Sorry Terry, but I've done lots of hiring and I don't consider physical appearance as a criteria. So no, not everyone considers looks. I'm not hiring for modelling jobs, obviously, I'm hiring scientists and engineers. By the way, I don't consider "dressing and grooming properly for an interview" to be physical appearance, that falls more within "interpersonal skills". Someone showing up in dirty ripped up jeans would be a problem, someone having a big nose, too little or too much curves would not.

To get back to the food business in particular, as a restaurant client I'd much rather have a 50 year old server who knows what she is doing than a pretty idiot who doesn't know her job, can't answer questions and makes mistakes in the order. You say that a pretty and competent server is better than just a competent one, I say it makes no difference to me. And if a restaurant chooses pretty and incompetent over competent and not pretty, I'm unlikely to return. Men may think differently, of course, and Moxies probably has lots of male clients, but how many of your clients are women, and how many couples where the woman picks the restaurant?

I find your comparison with bilingualism totally absurd. I would never not return to a restaurant because the server was ugly or fat or old. But there are restaurants I avoid because I can't get served in French... in Gatineau! In Ottawa, I appreciate French service but don't really mind if I don't get it... as long as I can at least get service in English.

Yes, when your main business is to have clients looking at the employees (like certain types of bars), I expect them to choose employees based on appearance, but I was really hoping owners of "real" restaurants didn't do that.

Oh, and you say "they hire male servers"... that doesn't mean the male servers are not also picked based on appearance. This type of discrimination is as despicable when applied to men as it is when applied to women.

Terry's mention of a great training program at Moxie's makes a lot of sense. I was honestly quite shocked at how professional the service was on my first visit to the "bar" side of the Kanata location. I would go there much more often if only more of the food were as good as the service and drinks!

The reality is, in a customer-facing position your appearance can be every bit as important as your actions.

We may not like the reality of staffing in the restaurant world, but it is just that, a reality. They are selling a product - I think of the servers as a part of the packaging, my anaology. Their physical appearance, hair, clothing etc., add or subtract from the overall experience. Their language, their behaviour, their demeanor - all of these things do as well. Now, could an unattractive person do these things well? Sure - but if I could hire someone who has all of that AND is average looking or better, why not? That doesn't make me a discriminatory hirer, it makes me a person who wants my business to succeed. They are called 'front of the house staff' for a reason.

In the kitchen, this is probably not as important as they are being judged by a different standard - what's coming out of there, not who cooked it.

There are a couple of higher end restaurants I've been to in Ottawa that only have male servers - is this wrong too? I don't think so - I think you should be able to hire whomever you want to represent your establishment and create the dining atmosphere you want for your customers.

Just my $0.02

I don't think my comparison with bilingualism is absurd & you just proved my point, you won't go to a Gatineau Restaurant if the server only speaks one of the official languages in Canada, therefore it's important to have blingual staff, I could never work there, I'm I bring discriminated against, you betcha!

I am a little offended that for some reason you think older less attractive people are somehow better servers; I disagree it depends on the person. There are attractive bad servers but believe it or not there are unattractive bad servers as well & visa versa...

Your hiring practises have nothing to do with interaction with the public, it isn't a fair comparison.

Moxies isn't a 'real' restaurant?

Jojo : yes, hiring only male (or only female) servers is wrong. It is even illegal in this country AFAIK.

Terry : Without going into politics, Quebec has only one official language and that is French. Still, most restaurants and other businesses in Gatineau offer service in English too, as a courtesy to clients (being able to serve more clients in their preferred language makes business sense). Ottawa is officially bilingual, but getting service, or even a menu, in French is pretty rare. Finding a job in French in Ottawa is even more difficult than finding a job in English in Gatineau. Yes, being bilingual will make it easier on both sides. But I will never understand why so many people in this region equal "French" with "bilingual". It's not like having French as a first language makes it easier to become bilingual. If there are more francophones that become bilingual, maybe it's just because it's so hard to find a job as an unilingual francophone (much harder than as an unilingual anglophone). Last time I check, less than 5% of jobs in the federal public service where open to unilingual francophones. But all that is really getting away from the subject here.

I didn't mention unattractive and incompetent servers because it seems clear that those would not get hired. And I never said being ugly made someone more competent. All I'm saying is that using appearance as a more important criteria than competence seems illogical to me.

I was hoping that hiring servers, being a job that require skills more than looks, would be closer to the hiring practices for scientists than to the hiring practice for models. Sadly, it apparently isn't the case. I'm just glad I'm not in that industry.

I'm going to chime in here. Restaurants have an image they are trying to project. Moxies, in general is trying to project a young, hip, and sexy image. Therefore, they hire people that will fit this image.

Since you seen enamored with scientists, here's a basic formula:

Looks + competency(a) > compentency(b) where competency(a) = comptency(b).

Also, your statement "I was hoping that hiring servers, being a job that require skills more than looks, would be closer to the hiring practices for scientists than to the hiring practice for models. " does not hold true. Models are hired for their skills as well. It's not easy walking in 8 inch stilletos looking fierce!

Fine, you want a formula, here is the one explaining my position :

Looks + competency(a) < compentency(b) where competency(a) < competency(b).

So, at equal competency, or lack therof, hire the pretty candidate, sure, makes no difference to me one way or another. But IF one is more competent, please hire this one, regardless of looks. I'd rather have good service than pretty service, if I have to choose.

(By the way I'm not "enamored" with scientists, I just happen to be one...)

OK I'll chime in. Being an engineer, hiring scientific folk usually is based on technical merit - however we are not customer facing - so it doesn't matter what our personal grooming habits are unless they effect the person in the next cube. Marketing/Sales people tend to be much more concerned with their appearance/wardrobe etc compared to their R&D counter parts. Restaurants are all about the customer facing staff - so as long as they are competent they will likely hire the best looking, friendliest staff they can afford - it just makes sense. If good looking people are also incompetent the restaurant will also fail.

As to bilingualism - I agree with Terry that it fits the mold. My parents moved to Ottawa for a number of years - my mom came with over 30 years of nursing experience - she speaks 3 languages fluently - none of them French. She could not get a nursing job.

In my case, it was sexy bad. The service was lousy, took us 10 minutes to get a drink, they kept coming back saying 'oh we don't have that' after long delays. They screwed up my food order. The fries were lousy, as was the steak sandwich.

This was the Bayshore location. Never stepped back.

Sexy bad. Margarita was fizzy and sweet. My order was not as per the menu description. This was at the Hunt Club location.

I certainly understand the role of "looks" in our society and none of this surprises me. My concern is with just how much looks should factor into a server's suitablity for the job. I expect looks to be important in terms of dress, cleanliness and health but when the criteria is boiled down to "big tits" I think that's a tipping point in the very wrong direction.

I don't even have a problem with niche places like Hooters and Moxie's doing what they do but I will be concerned if this trend starts to infringe on the greater restaurant market. The last thing an unemployed person needs is more barriers.

Oh, boy. Not sure if I dare add to this thread, it was a hoot reading it though!
I was at the Bayshore Moxies years ago. I was pregnant with my first baby, so I was WAY more interested in dessert than how the waitresses were dressed. lol!

Here are the humerous things I remember. Weren't funny at the time, but after reading all this, they seem funny now.

It was my great Aunt who took my hubbie and I there for lunch. I recall her saying she liked the food and thought the staff were really nice. I guess she didn't care about the outfits!

The waitress we had turned out to be a old friend of mine that I had known since grade 7. This was a girl who LOVED to dress, um, well, they way people are describing. To her, the more showing the better. The more racy the better. The more shocking the better. I remember be a teeny bit worried about what my great Auntie might think of this boobs-in-your-face woman bringing our food. One the way home, my aunt said what a nice girl she was, and that she hoped to see her again when she ate there next! Auntie!! I'm shocked you approved of her! lol!

For my friend working there, the way she was dressed, is the way she dressed all the time. Over the top hair, makeup and clothes. But, that's what's always made her happy. She likes her body, and likes showing it. And when I say over the top, I'm saying over the top for me. That's the grand thing about life, we're all different!

Now, I must done my rubber boots and leather gloves and go pull some teats. Dear me, that sounds naughty. I simply need to go milk the my cow. Oh, now I really think I'm digging a big hole... ;-)

Thanks for sharing that story, organicgirl! Your perspective is an excellent one. :-)

Am I the only one totally shocked by the 2nd or 3rd comment that it was pretty hard to mess up a straight vodka martini? I've had those messed up in bars many a time! :)

Let me just say how impressed I am that we are STILL flogging this thread after 4 years!

What can I say... we're bringing sexy back (Justin Timberlake reference!)

Sexy good, food below average . . .

Check out this article about the I I 0 RESUME rating system at Moxie's

lifewise.canoe.ca

Hahaha... and we come full circle! Gaelle, that article is what kicked off the latest round of discussion in this forum topic. :-)

Guess who's baaaaaack? haha I'm super impressed this thread kept going until 2011, I shed a tear of pride.

I haven't made a visit to Moxie's in almost 4 years, since I moved to Toronto but it seems I'll be moving back to Ottawa this winter for good! I'm not so broken up over scantilly clad waitresses anymore, a few years can really change someone's perspective on life I suppose. I just don't go to Moxie's anymore because the food is pretty bad.

Cheers!

I've never seen this thread before; I have nothing to add to the Moxies debate other than to say that my wife likes going there when we're shopping or going to the cinema, but I am very disappointed to discover from her post on March 23rd, 2011 that Isabelle actively admits to discriminating against people based upon how they dress.

For shame, Isabelle, for shame.

I'm trying to find where you see that in what I wrote, Johnny English... the part about "dirty ripped up jeans"? I already acknowledged that one should wear clean clothes to a restaurant. I'd say that applies even more to job interviews. Yes, I'd give some negative points to a candidate showing up in dirty ripped up clothes (unless he has a very good explanation like crashing his bike on the way to the interview).

But did you really comment on this thread just to take a dig at me regarding a post I wrote over a year ago?

Impressive.

So, can anyone tell me if there is a way to ignore specific people on this site?

To ignore you click on someone's name/avatar then on the right side, click 'block this user'.

I believe the "block this user" button will only prevent the person sending you DM's and commenting on their profiles.

Isabelle You might want to have a look at the "Help" wiki: ottawafoodies.com/about (Blocking users is in #12 on the list.)

Or, you could try and be a little less of a [sexist label deleted - FF] about it. I'm very happy if you don't wish to continue the conversation, just don't keep having the last word and then getting upset when it doesn't work. The whole conversation was finished several days ago and almost off the front page until you chose to bring it back up.

There you go, my last word. I meant you no offense, and there was no need for you to take any. [patronizing remark deleted - FF]

I've seen way more cleavage at Moxies than I ever used to see at hooters... And who really cares what others are wearing? if the establishment that you're in allows them in, should you really complain about it? or should you just go somewhere higher priced and enjoy looking at others higher priced clothing... And just for the record, some of those ripped pieces of clothing cost 3 times what my nice dress pants do...

Last time I went to Moxies was only to use up a gift card we had received. We got "Dale" from Australia as our waiter... anyway, the food sucks and that's all that matters.

Yes I've friends who wear jeans over 1k, couldn't be bothered myself but they're generally ripped, dyed or spotted.

Moxies is eye candy, horrid food, and overpriced alcohol.

FF - the first bit you deleted isn't sexist, that label applies equally regardless of gender.

Your second deletion is, in hindsight, entirely appropriate and I apologise for that.

Johnny English, if not sexist, then it was at the very least a disrespectful slur -- something we like to minimize around here. Respect is a two-way street and the only way to get it is to give it.

Ravi, I find your use of hyperbole to be counterproductive. If you honestly think Moxie's food is horrid, then dining must generally be a miserable experience for you. It is not the best in town, maybe even by a long shot, but it certainly isn't horrid (i.e. "repulsive'" as in you would only eat it if in the final stages of starvation). Note: my observation is subsequent to your use of "a pound of salt" to describe the seasoning of your fries at Back Lane Café . This is a good time to remind people that hyperbole is even less useful in negative reviews than in positive ones.

Now, who else needs a wrist slap?? ;-)

Ff, have you been to Moxies? I've been going for over a decade. I've been a silly amount of times, I do eat there, and I do think it's horrid. Not end of the world horrid, but certainly disappointing. Drinks are good on the other hand, it's usually many of those that results in food being ordered.

I've had so many meals go sideways there, I know a number of the kitchen staff, and the stories are scary. You're right, if I compare my worst Moxies experience to the back lane cafe one. Moxies serves better food. This is one of the times I didn't take a photo. If you saw the amount of salt in the plates it was crazy. I put my finger in the plate and it came out dusted in salt. The fries you can tell had promise, but the kitchen possibly triple salted. It wasn't just my fries either.

Ravi, if you managed to eat more than one forkful of anything there, it was not horrid. Eating someone else's vomit is horrid (or so I'm led to believe). My concern is not with your opinions (which I think are valid, even though it isn't my place to say so) but rather with the exaggerated tone. I fully believe you that the fries at Backlane were over salted. I do not, however, believe it when you state that there were 454 grams of salt on your plate. :-)

454grains of salt per fry then? Lol.

Yes yes, certainly by no means vomit food. I just wouldn't point anyone at their menu in good conscience. Moxies serves a purpose, drinks, eye candy and food. In that order. Well. Maybe eye candy first, it's attributable to most of the times I get dragged there. You can do lots worse than Moxies for food I suppose. Bah

i hated moxies until I was invited to the Moxie's in Kanata. Love the layout - it is very "sexy"! drinks were great too and if you like hot blondes - dont miss out! :)

"My concern is not with your opinions (which I think are valid, even though it isn't my place to say so) but rather with the exaggerated tone. I fully believe you that the fries at Backlane were over salted. I do not, however, believe it when you state that there were 454 grams of salt on your plate."

LOL! yup that's pretty darn exaggerated. sounds like something my mom would say. i love my mom but she can get dramatic at times. still good for a laugh however!

heh heh 454...

We were in Orleans last night and stopped at the relatively new Moxies by Lowes on Innes Road. It has the usual extremely good standard of decor (that isn't a euphemism!) and those equalitarians amongst us will perhaps be pleased to hear that there were several male servers, all of whom were clearly subject to the same hiring practices as the ladies given their dashing looks (according to my wife, obviously).

What we were particularly impressed with, though, was the standard of the food. I haven't been to a Moxies in a while and I believe that their menu has been overhauled by a new exec chef. If last night was anything to go by, he has done an excellent job - the penne toscana was deep, rich and beautifully balanced, while my wife's red chicken curry was better than anything produced by probably 80% of the Thai restaurants I've eaten at in recent times. Two main courses and a couple of drinks each were a very reasonable $60 - got to say I was hugely impressed, and as a low key midweek meal out I think you'll have to go a long way to beat it.