Raw Milk [General]
2012 Oct 16
Illegal indeed! And raw milk's food safety record is a rather spotty. Some nice folks at Kansas State University keep a list of North American food safety incidents caused by raw milk:
bites.ksu.edu/rawmilk
It makes for interesting reading.
bites.ksu.edu/rawmilk
It makes for interesting reading.
2012 Oct 17
I find raw milk an interesting issue. I was an urban dweller growing up, but we bought milk from a small farm on the edge of town. Twice a week we would drive over to the farm and pick up two ice cream pails of milk that were set in a box fixed to the side of the house. We would take it home, refrigerate it to cool and settle.and then skim off the cream for later use. Looking back I am a little shocked that we would simply leave milk outside at whatever temperature for a couple of hours. No one ever was sick due to milk in my family, but one anecdote does not good policy make.
2012 Oct 17
Am pretty sure no dairy farmer with quota would risk giving or selling you some. That being said, as a kid I grew up on it. Never got sick. Not sure where ma got it but it was some local farmer on the prairies. Most of my friends and neighbors eat a healthy supply of raw milk cheese on a regular basis.
As with anything there is risk of contamination. I think the link above is excellent and wish they would have provided detail on how the contamination occurred. I also do not buy into this whole health benefit from raw milk. I do buy into the health benefits from eating a diet of predominantly unprocessed foods.
I searched high and low in my area for a dairy farmer willing to 'cooperate' and got nothing so I ended up buying my own Jersey. I cannot sell it to you or give it to you but I can offer you the experience of milking Rosie yourself and taking it home. That way I am not transferring it to you :)
Takes about 10 mins and is done via a machine. Oh and as a teen I could drink 2L a day with cream included. Rosie gives milk that is approx 5% and I cannot drink it that way any more and run it through a separator.
PM me if interested.
As with anything there is risk of contamination. I think the link above is excellent and wish they would have provided detail on how the contamination occurred. I also do not buy into this whole health benefit from raw milk. I do buy into the health benefits from eating a diet of predominantly unprocessed foods.
I searched high and low in my area for a dairy farmer willing to 'cooperate' and got nothing so I ended up buying my own Jersey. I cannot sell it to you or give it to you but I can offer you the experience of milking Rosie yourself and taking it home. That way I am not transferring it to you :)
Takes about 10 mins and is done via a machine. Oh and as a teen I could drink 2L a day with cream included. Rosie gives milk that is approx 5% and I cannot drink it that way any more and run it through a separator.
PM me if interested.
2012 Oct 17
Non profit milk ;)
I have no issue with someone wanting to try it and letting them 'have access' to the cow to milk her.
You would be surprised what I have given away for free to fight the cause of government over rotation on regulations.
Smoker Guy's family has not died from raw milk cheese! Of course I have no clue where he got it.
I have no issue with someone wanting to try it and letting them 'have access' to the cow to milk her.
You would be surprised what I have given away for free to fight the cause of government over rotation on regulations.
Smoker Guy's family has not died from raw milk cheese! Of course I have no clue where he got it.
2012 Oct 17
Well as I think I've noted elsewhere I think you'd be crazy to drink raw milk unless you knew every detail of how it got from the cow to your mouth - and even with some small farmers who are willing to sell you a cow share you won't necessarily get that.
But farm-fresh milk is truly a spectacular product that is an order of magnitude better tasting than the store bought stuff. I think it must be the homogenization that destroys the supermarket stuff because I pasteurized my farm fresh milk and it was still an order of magnitude more flavourful than the store bought stuff.
But farm-fresh milk is truly a spectacular product that is an order of magnitude better tasting than the store bought stuff. I think it must be the homogenization that destroys the supermarket stuff because I pasteurized my farm fresh milk and it was still an order of magnitude more flavourful than the store bought stuff.
2012 Oct 17
I had no idea it was illegal!
So how long have you had Rosie for? Do you just have the one Jersey? And why not Holstein?
I wonder if I could buy a cow but pay for someone to keep it. I could go visit her and milk her, I just live in the city :(
Haha I have so many questions and ideas around this now.
So how long have you had Rosie for? Do you just have the one Jersey? And why not Holstein?
I wonder if I could buy a cow but pay for someone to keep it. I could go visit her and milk her, I just live in the city :(
Haha I have so many questions and ideas around this now.
2012 Oct 18
I still say it has a lot to do with the distance travelled as well. I can't imagine that the cows that Cochrane's uses are any different from the cows that other Ontario milk producers use, yet the milk is so much better tasting. I've mentioned this before, but the everyday milk in New Brunswick in any convenience store is better than any major producer in our province. My guess is that because it has to travel a greater distance to get to a processing plant (and then again through distribution), it has to affect the taste somehow.
I can't drink 'regular' milk anymore. I used to think it was the carton, so switched to bags. Same thing. Plus, I can get Cochrane's delivered to my door. In glass bottles if I want.
Yes, I love Cochrane's. This is a wholehearted advertisement for them.
I can't drink 'regular' milk anymore. I used to think it was the carton, so switched to bags. Same thing. Plus, I can get Cochrane's delivered to my door. In glass bottles if I want.
Yes, I love Cochrane's. This is a wholehearted advertisement for them.
2012 Oct 18
As far as taste goes.....some of these big dairies claim to use micro filtering techniques to improve the flavor. Mine goes through a stainless mesh for filtering when warm and that is it. If you have gone to a factory dairy, their cows stand in stalls all day long, get fed hay and someone comes up behind them and shovels the shit away. Rosie spends her day basking in the sun outside, eating bark off trees and a good healthy dose of hay. She comes running when it is time for milking as there is a bucket of grain for her.
My Jersey gives me about 4 gallons a day which is more than I can use. Some gets drank, some goes to experimental cheese, some goes to ice cream, some goes into butter, most goes into cheese, some into kefir and yogurt, some baking and also some to the pigs. A Holstein would give double that and I don't need that much! Plus a Jersey is smaller.
My Jersey gives me about 4 gallons a day which is more than I can use. Some gets drank, some goes to experimental cheese, some goes to ice cream, some goes into butter, most goes into cheese, some into kefir and yogurt, some baking and also some to the pigs. A Holstein would give double that and I don't need that much! Plus a Jersey is smaller.
2012 Oct 18
Weve been eating raw milk cheese for a few months now, just seems to show up every once in a while. Great stuff. Will vouch for krusty as long as you keep it refrigerated and use some common sense as far as shelf life the stuff is great. Way tastier than any mozza you can buy in the store.
2012 Oct 20
Maybe OG will chime in as I thought she had a Dexter or two. There is a possibility of cow shares in the future. Michael Schmidt is trying to get the people of Ont some freedom and access to raw milk.
Though I agree with Zym, pasturization is quick, easy and ensures there there are no bad bacteria. There have been studies looking at who are the folks who get sick from drinking raw milk. It is typically someone young or old or someone who has a pre-existing condition. Those in the city are at higher risk given they are not as exposed to as much bacteria as someone who has to shovel animal dung out of the pen.
Though I agree with Zym, pasturization is quick, easy and ensures there there are no bad bacteria. There have been studies looking at who are the folks who get sick from drinking raw milk. It is typically someone young or old or someone who has a pre-existing condition. Those in the city are at higher risk given they are not as exposed to as much bacteria as someone who has to shovel animal dung out of the pen.
2012 Oct 21
I've put the information for milk delivery in another thread:
ottawafoodies.com
BTW, we started getting the 2 liter jugs delivered instead of the 1 liter bottles. It tastes the same and takes up less room in the fridge.
OO! Can't forget to add some buttermilk to my order this week if I want to make pancakes. And I do. REAL buttermilk, not that faked stuff you get in the stores.
ottawafoodies.com
BTW, we started getting the 2 liter jugs delivered instead of the 1 liter bottles. It tastes the same and takes up less room in the fridge.
OO! Can't forget to add some buttermilk to my order this week if I want to make pancakes. And I do. REAL buttermilk, not that faked stuff you get in the stores.
2012 Oct 22
Raw milk, such an interesting topic!
Sadie Lady, I’m fascinated that you knew enough to be interested in raw/unpasteurized milk, but weren’t aware that it’s illegal. You might be interested to know that most things are illegal for small farmers! Sad, but true.
Some basic good rules of thumb when sourcing raw milk are :
-check out the farmer and their dairy practices, ask LOTS of questions.
-the milk should keep for 10-15 days in a fridge the correct temperature,
-and you should be able to make good cheese with it in a raw state. If you have to pasteurize the milk to make cheese or yogurt, there’s a problem with the milk or the milk handling practices of the farmer.
Ddueck, raw milk left at room temperature allows the lactic bacteria to do it’s work and prevent contamination by unwanted bacteria in some cases.
Most modern day dairy practices require fast chilling, which is great for milk produced in questionable methods that is destined to be pasteurized, but healthy milk from healthy cows raised in a healthy way is very different. Maybe kinda like how good quality grass fed meats do better with a slower cool down than what the slaughter houses must do to conform to government regulations.
I think there are benefits to raw milk as much as there are benefits to raw anything. I wouldn’t want to only ever buy/eat cooked veggies, cooked fruits, or cooked meats. All of those things have benefits in both formats, and so far, the government lets me to decide how and when I will (or won’t) cook those things.
I’m of the mind that pasteurization is needed for some dairy farms. If the milk ain’t clean, you’d better cook it! But along the lines of what zymurgist said, I’m also of the mind that it’s homogenization that is the real culprit to many of the problems people have with milk. I think it's Harmony that sells un-homogenized milk. Maybe Cochrane's does too?
Krusty, I hope you realize that you can also sell food to stand up for food freedom, lol! And I’ll bet your cows milk is probably closer to 6%. We’ve had two of our cows tested so far, and the Jersey was 5.75% and our Dexter was 5.87%. But, to look at the two milks side by side, you’d be sure it was our Jersey with higher butterfat! Her creamline looks better because the fat particles are bigger.
There are many people in Canada who are working towards the legalization of raw milk products. I’d love to see it be more than just cow shares. I love my cows, but I wouldn’t sell them to anyone. The PFO (Practical Farmers of Ontario) are also working on changing/updating the rules about milk sales. And, I’m told by some of the rawmilk legalization working groups I’m a part of, that the DFO (Dairy Farmers of Ontario) is poised to allow the farmgate sale of raw milk.
Sadie Lady, I’m fascinated that you knew enough to be interested in raw/unpasteurized milk, but weren’t aware that it’s illegal. You might be interested to know that most things are illegal for small farmers! Sad, but true.
Some basic good rules of thumb when sourcing raw milk are :
-check out the farmer and their dairy practices, ask LOTS of questions.
-the milk should keep for 10-15 days in a fridge the correct temperature,
-and you should be able to make good cheese with it in a raw state. If you have to pasteurize the milk to make cheese or yogurt, there’s a problem with the milk or the milk handling practices of the farmer.
Ddueck, raw milk left at room temperature allows the lactic bacteria to do it’s work and prevent contamination by unwanted bacteria in some cases.
Most modern day dairy practices require fast chilling, which is great for milk produced in questionable methods that is destined to be pasteurized, but healthy milk from healthy cows raised in a healthy way is very different. Maybe kinda like how good quality grass fed meats do better with a slower cool down than what the slaughter houses must do to conform to government regulations.
I think there are benefits to raw milk as much as there are benefits to raw anything. I wouldn’t want to only ever buy/eat cooked veggies, cooked fruits, or cooked meats. All of those things have benefits in both formats, and so far, the government lets me to decide how and when I will (or won’t) cook those things.
I’m of the mind that pasteurization is needed for some dairy farms. If the milk ain’t clean, you’d better cook it! But along the lines of what zymurgist said, I’m also of the mind that it’s homogenization that is the real culprit to many of the problems people have with milk. I think it's Harmony that sells un-homogenized milk. Maybe Cochrane's does too?
Krusty, I hope you realize that you can also sell food to stand up for food freedom, lol! And I’ll bet your cows milk is probably closer to 6%. We’ve had two of our cows tested so far, and the Jersey was 5.75% and our Dexter was 5.87%. But, to look at the two milks side by side, you’d be sure it was our Jersey with higher butterfat! Her creamline looks better because the fat particles are bigger.
There are many people in Canada who are working towards the legalization of raw milk products. I’d love to see it be more than just cow shares. I love my cows, but I wouldn’t sell them to anyone. The PFO (Practical Farmers of Ontario) are also working on changing/updating the rules about milk sales. And, I’m told by some of the rawmilk legalization working groups I’m a part of, that the DFO (Dairy Farmers of Ontario) is poised to allow the farmgate sale of raw milk.
Sadie_Lady
I was hoping to go SUPER local and SUPER fresh.
Does anyone know where I could get milk... unpasteurized? I haven't seen many people do this, but I just wanted a litre or so to try. Anybody know any dairy farmers who would like to share? :)