Brewery Market this Saturday Oct 13 in Hintonburg [General]

2012 Oct 10
If the weather is nice this could be fun:

www.brewerymarket.com

From the site: "If you’ve ever been curious about how great the Ottawa beer scene has emerged the past couple of years, this is the event for you! As for beer highlights, you can expect to see some of Beau’s Greener Futures, usually a members-only barrel aged club, available on offer. Mill Street will be celebrating the season with Pumpkin and Oktoberfest beers, along with a special cask from the pub... On the food front, you can expect some delicious beer inspired dishes – Hintonburg Public House is planning to serve a crispy cod on a bun made with Kichesippi 1855 and Hintonburger has been planning a Beau’s Burger & a HogsBack Bacon Burger. And there will be more great offerings from Union 613 and Relish Food Truck as well.

The Ottawa edition of the Brewery Market will be taking place from 12-8pm at 1000 Wellington Street West in Hintonburg. We hope to see you there"

Any other foodies thinking of heading over? Maybe this could be an opportunity for an informal meet-up?

2012 Oct 11
The Green Party of Ontario will also be announcing their plan to end the (foreign-owned) Beer Store monopoly at the Market:

kevino.ca

2012 Oct 11
So they'll be making this announcement this weekend at the Brewery Market?

2012 Oct 11
there's a 'free beer!' joke in there somewhere...

2012 Oct 11
No sampler size beers available according to a post on their facebook event page. Just $6 cups. Not sure how many new beers one will be able to sample if they're that big. Not very smart thinking by the organizers, but perhaps it's a liquor licence thing? Any ideas?

2012 Oct 11
Yes they will ... so much for that being a secret til then though :-)

2012 Oct 11
Why keep that a secret? That will attract people who want to taste new beers which is the whole point of the event.

2012 Oct 11
No, I mean I got an advanced copy of the press release to proof read and was asked to keep it in confidence until then. Well I guess that lasted about 2 hours and suddenly I was seeing it everywhere :-) Kevin changed his mind and figured it would be best to get a wider review from beer geeks before the release.

2012 Oct 11
No idea what that means, sorry. If they will have sampler sizes, why has that been explicitly denied by organizers? And why is a press release secret, isn't that the definition of counter-productive?

2012 Oct 11
Zym is talking about the Green Party policy AD_2.

2012 Oct 11
Ugh. Thanks for clearing that up Brian Mc.

2012 Oct 12
"Just $6 cups."

Cups or mugs? Hoping for something substantial at that price.

I'll probably check this out at some point during the day, weather depending.


2012 Oct 12
I don't know which kind of receptacle. Assuming plastic cups because what else would it be, but don't know for sure. Agreed, hope it's substantial for $6. I'd be more prone to go to this event if samples were available though. I don't need / have time / want / want to spend the money on a Saturday afternoon. Not to mention driving there and not being sober for the rest of the day.

2012 Oct 12
Two words : public transit

2012 Oct 12
No sample sizes, just full pints... then what's the point? This is disappointing. I can sit at a bar, order half pints and try 4 different beers seeing as 2 full pints is about my limit. I may walk by just to browse but this 'tasting' format puts a whole different spin on things. :~|

2012 Oct 12
Simple Solution to the Pint Size offerings;

Purchase a pint and share it between 2-3 People. :)


2012 Oct 12
Any confirmation that these are actual full imperial pints Johanna? Anything less and I'll definitely just end up at The Carleton or my condo.

2012 Oct 12
*BrianMc*, I'm going by AD_2's comment about cups of beer for $6. At that price I'm assuming these are full pints otherwise my money will be better spent at a pub or at home. ;o)

That said, I'm curious about Beyond the Pale's offerings, and the crispy cod sandwich HPH proposes sounds interesting. As an update, the Relish food truck was supposed to be in attendance but unfortunately won't be able to make it... a shame as they were thinking of mixing beer into their fresh made tortillas. :o)

2012 Oct 12
Hate to say it, but BtP is out. Don't have all their permits yet.

2012 Oct 12
No Beyond the Pale, check, no Relish, check.

OK, so Beau's I can get anywhere, ditto for Mill Street, not interested in Big Rig or Clocktower as I won't be going to either of these places for a repeat even if they brew good stuff, Ashton's on tap right now at Union, already had (and loved) Broadhead, so that leaves Cassel and HogsBack to pique my curiosity enough for me to drop by tomorrow (or my other half so that he can twist my arm...)

Well then, let's see what the weather looks like and hope that the snow holds off ;o)

2012 Oct 12
"Any confirmation that these are actual full imperial pints Johanna? Anything less and I'll definitely just end up at The Carleton or my condo."

According to the web site: "Beer will be served in full size 12 ounce servings."

I'm glad it will be the "full" 12 ounces instead of the alternative. ;)

But yeah, that's not a pint so it's a little pricey. I'd be cool with $4 and would probably end up tipping a buck on each beer. If the motivation for the event is to expose local product to new clientele then I don't understand the high price point. If it's just about getting drunk outside in October then it makes a little more sense. ;)

In any case, I'll still probably drop by and it's cool that people are trying new things in Ottawa. I was looking forward to Beyond The Pale the most though. :(


2012 Oct 13
you do know this is trying to raise money for a good cause, right? river keeper

2012 Oct 13
Huge turn-out, 30 kinds of beer, including neighbourhood brewers like Hintonbrew. Fantastic event.

2012 Oct 13
Meh. I went down to check it out around 3pm and the line-up to get in was so long I couldn't be bothered sticking around.

Too bad it was in such a small spot.

2012 Oct 13
Fun event. Got there at open so beat the crowds, no line-ups for anything. Food was sparse, but good, can't go wrong with Hintonburger. Nothing particularly interesting on tap, but lots of quality brews. Was impressed by the Ashton range and always happy to see Millstreet Whitecap on cask. Kind of put off that there weren't any one-offs.

2012 Oct 13
From my perspective the value just wasn't there so we left after 20 minutes.

On offer were half pints of beer in a plastic cup for $6, and the opportunity to pay $6 for a 4oz Hintonburger with no toppings other than beer braised onions or a measly piece of back bacon. The advertised crispy cod sandwich from HPH turned into 3 croquettes of beer and bacon with a side of spicy mayo, also $6. And Union was there serving up a piece of fried chicken on a bed of coleslaw, also for $6.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Ottawa is so starved of decent events that people will completely disregard value for money just to get out of the house.

"you do know this is trying to raise money for a good cause, right? river keeper"

Actually this isn't a charitable event, it is a for profit venture where a portion of the proceeds are being donated and the reason for having a charity involved has to do with liquor licensing permits. If one is seriously interested in supporting a good cause then the cash would be put to better use by visiting www.ottawariverkeeper.ca and making a donation in exchange for a tax receipt.

2012 Oct 13
"I've said it before and I'll say it again: Ottawa is so starved of decent events that people will completely disregard value for money just to get out of the house."

Um, not really. Prices were in line with the past Beer Market events in Toronto and they pull in the same sort of crowds. It wasn't any more expensive for free admission festivals I've attended elsewhere in Canada, Ireland, England, the US, and even a couple pricier ones in continental Europe.

Cheaper is always better, but the prices were comparable to similar events and it's affordable for the market they're after. Though I guess sniffing at the silly Ottawa plebs is always a good way to pump up one's foodie rep.

2012 Oct 13
Uhm Brian...

"Any confirmation that these are actual full imperial pints Johanna? Anything less and I'll definitely just end up at The Carleton or my condo."

"Prices were in line with the past Beer Market events in Toronto and [] It wasn't any more expensive for free admission festivals I've attended elsewhere..."

Do you have a twin posting under your account or have you simply changed your mind after a few beers? Cuz last time I checked a half pint was definitely less than a full imperial pint so that puts you at The Carleton this afternoon, no?

"Though I guess sniffing at the silly Ottawa plebs is always a good way to pump up one's foodie rep."

Absolutely Brian, you're so on to my cheap attempt at boosting my cred with my fellow anonymous posters on the Internet. In fact why even bother, maybe I should try my hand at hipster-ism instead of foodie-ism.

2012 Oct 13
I think it is pricey for a beer, but it's in line with other events like this. The implicit suggestion that the turnout was just symptomatic of a lack of sophistication among Ottawa punters is just nonsense.

2012 Oct 13
I think a market like this is great for Ottawa. Hopefully we can spark some ideas in people to organize even better ones. I would spend even more money if I could to have small markets over the wine and food show any day.

2012 Oct 13
"The implicit suggestion that the turnout was just symptomatic of a lack of sophistication among Ottawa punters is just nonsense."

Don't recall saying anything even remotely like this but feel free to requote as it suits you.

"I would spend even more money if I could to have small markets over the wine and food show any day."

HFF, agreed, but that's probably just me looking to bolster my foodie cred by bashing unsophisticated Ottawa plebs again. We'll let Brian make the final call.

2012 Oct 13
While I would never beg the question, some interesting points were raised. I am not sure about charitable status for alcohol based events,. My understanding is that it can be used to accept alcohol donations, usually contrary to the liquor rules in Ontario, but often used to raffle nice bottles of wine. Connecting your event to a charity is often a nice thing to do and, for some, a great PR move and a great way to make your event appeal to those who want to support local ventures. A quick Google search on the event brought up the involvement of Bar Towel and Cecktor Ltd, importers of specialty beers. As for the serving size, that is something that you have to put on your liquor permit application in advance of the event. Food and Wine Show is a 4oz serving.

2012 Oct 14
Personally I think the prices charged for a marketing like event is excessive. Though I find the wine prices and the F&W show to be excessive as well. Compared to what you would be charged at a US version of this, I think as J said, we are starved for good events.

2012 Oct 14
I had a great time at this mini beer fest yesterday. Got there around 5pm and was put off by the long line but it moved fast and we were in in about 20 minutes.

While I had initial reservations about the pricing I didn't really think about it once I was there. From what I understand, all proceeds after covering cost go to the charity. Someone close to the organizers told me it was the most successful fundraising event ever for this charity. Many of the vendors were generous with their pour as well so it was all good.

Sampler sizes would have been nice though. I pounded back a lot of suds in my quest to try as many new beers as possible. ;)

I had the Ashton Vanilla Stout, 3 from Beau's (Gose, Belgian Pale Ale, Schwarz), Cassel White, and 2 from Broadhead (Underdog, Wildcard). Everything was at least good with the Vanilla Stout the stand out.

I think they're planning another one for Spring. They'll need a bigger venue for sure!


2012 Oct 14
Tree Pug, having organized these kind of events for the past 9 years, I can assure you that affiliating oneself with a charity is about taking advantage of the favourable terms for purchasing liquor, end of story. To quote the AGCO:

"Manufacturers may donate liquor to organizations that are registered under the Income Tax Act (Canada) [non-profit corporations] or non-profit associations and organizations for the advancement of charitable, educational, religious or community objects."

These are the only organizations that can take advantage of this financial break, which allows them to sell liquor at a profit for fundraising purposes, and at a much lower cost than a regular licensee or special occasion permit holder.

To illustrate, the Wellington Gastropub buys a keg of Beau's at full retail cost which includes the provincial, federal and LCBO mark-ups, and then pays an additional 16% sale levy charged by the AGCO. They then turn around and sell me a pint of Beau's for $6.50, in a warm, cozy bar with comfortable seating, full service washrooms and knowledgeable staff, some of whom are in fact home brewers. Also keep in mind that the $6.50 they charge has to cover a portion of their overhead costs such as lease in a trendy neighbourhood, wages, hydro, gas, insurance, etc.

Similarly, to sample its beer at the Ottawa Wine and Food Show, Beau's and other vendors have to buy their own beer/wine/spirits at full retail cost plus the 16% sale levy. Also note that events such as the Ottawa Wine and Food Show operate under a permit that only allows them to 'sample' alcohol, not sell it, and definitely not make a profit from it.

By contrast obtaining a liquor permit through a charitable organization means that the organizer (ie Brewery Market) gets the juice at a substantial discount to what any licensee or regular SOP holder pays. Notwithstanding, they still managed to charge $6 for a half pint of beer and I won't rehash what they charged for food, all of which could be had for less in those same establishments.

With all this said, anyone wishing to believe that a couple of guys came up from Toronto with the express purpose of fundraising on behalf of our beautiful Ottawa River, please be my guest. But either way you cut it, there simply wasn't value for money at yesterday's Brewery Market... and I'm being tactful with my words. Apologies if the truth makes me come across as a Debbie Downer. ;o)

Tree Pug, as for sample sizes, this is up to the discretion of the manufacturer, representative or event organizer, and nowhere on the application does the AGCO ask for this information, so the Brewery Market was under no obligation -- regulatory or otherwise -- to cheap out with their $6 tasting cups.

"From what I understand, proceeds after covering cost go to the charity"

LOL... Ollie, if you saw a pie chart of these costs you may find yourself surprised to see how much goes to cover organizer's salaries, bonuses and 'consulting fees'. Funny enough, this sort of information rarely makes its way into the public domain. But at least we can sleep better knowing that people in Toronto are looking out for Ottawa's natural resources, just out of the goodness of their hearts. ;o)

Yes, thumbs down everyone... and please keep in mind that the United Way campaign is currently underway, in case anyone is actually serious about supporting a charitable organization.

2012 Oct 14
Johanna - are you implying that the organizers of the event Saturday took a salary, bonus and 'consulting fees' or are you saying that about the RiverKeeper (charitable organization this event was benefiting)?

2012 Oct 14
AD_2 I'm implying that the organizers of Saturday's event -- the middlemen between the attendees with the cash and the Ottawa River Keeper -- were motivated by profit rather than good karma, and that the charitable affiliation of this event was established in order to make a profit.

Keep in mind that there's nothing wrong with this, it's a valid business model, no rules have been contravened, and it's nice to see an event that promotes local breweries.

But it still doesn't blind me to the fact that half pints were being sold for $6, which is simply a ridiculous price and one that can't be justified by the so-called charity angle. If it was a full pint for $6 then I might have seen the value, and may have stayed to sample a few more.

2012 Oct 14
The RiverKeeper was thrilled with this event. They have nothing but happy, positive feedback and were very verbal in thanks in person, on twitter, etc.

Johanna's attitude towards the event is her own and was not shared by many -if anyone else. People are still talking happily about it and look forward to the next event in the Spring.

Edit to add: $6 for the hintonburger was a good deal. They spent a lot of time and effort in putting the touches together before hand. After working with Hintonburger at one of their 3 community events this weekend, I have only fantastic things to say about them and their crew. They are doing a lot for the community. At one of the events this weekend, they gave away their burgers for free. Not many other businesses will do that.

2012 Oct 14
I dunno, I find Johanna pretty negative in general but $6 for a half pint I'm inclined to weigh in her favour on this one. Holy crap. Beaus at Oktoberfest was dirt cheap ( I don't even recall - $5 a beer or something? ) and now I know why. In part because it is all volunteer run, and in part because when selling it for charity it can cost a lot less.

$6 for a half pint is unforgivable given the no overhead. And I volunteered all summer for the Riverkeeper.

2012 Oct 14
@HFF, fair enough, we're all posting our own opinion, but nowhere in my 3 posts have I criticized Hintonburger, the Ottawa River Keeper, anyone participating in the event, or the citizens of our fair city.

To reiterate my opinion -- my own and nobody else's -- $6 for a half pint was a ridiculous amount to charge, and the food was similarly overpriced, charity involvement or not. And... this topic seems to have gotten somewhat out of hand, so if it's OK I'll bow out now and let those who had a good time take over the thread. ;o)

2012 Oct 14
i enjoyed my 6 dollar beers very much. Btw this was organized by someone living in Ottawa, who lived in Toronto and is good friends with Cass, the original beer market organizer.

2012 Oct 15
Hello Fellow Foodies!
A big thank you to anybody who came out this weekend and made the Inaugural Ottawa Brewery Market the success that it was. The beer was colder than the weather, and that’s a beautiful thing.

My name is Taralyn Marshall, and I was the organizer behind the event in Ottawa. I live and work in this city, love beer and was really happy to help bring this event together. I think it’s the kind of event that not only supports great beer, but also can make for a richer community, all while supporting a great cause.

I would like to clear the air on some interesting things that are being said in this forum.

The Ottawa Brewery Market is based on a model that was successfully built in Toronto by Cass Enright. I don’t make a salary, bonuses or anything else you may find on a flashy pie chart, from events – but I do love pie. And I do love beer.

12oz beers, not 8oz as some are suggesting, were served for $6.

We purchased all beer under an SOP (special occasion permit) and did not receive donated liquor of any kind.

No event like this happens without overhead. Advertising, rentals, power, insurance, security etc.. all come at a cost. After all of these costs are covered, the remainder of the proceeds will go to the Ottawa Riverkeeper (yay!).

Everybody who came out to the event can rest assured that the money they spent went to support exactly what they knew they were supporting – great local beer, a vibrant community and a worthwhile charity. Seems like a pretty great deal for most!

If anybody has any questions, I’d be more than happy to answer them directly! info@brewerymarket.com or taralyn.marshall@gmail.com

We are certainly planning on holding this event again – and hopefully in a bigger space!! Really looking forward to it.

Cheers,
Taralyn

2012 Oct 15
OK, $6 for a regular sized beer is decent enough. And sounds like Johanna was talking out of her backside for the most part.

2012 Oct 15
Will be there a financial statement published for the event?

From the Durham Beer Festival with a couple hundred beers to sample is $45 for 4 hours:

The World Beer Festival has two sessions, ticketed separately. Each session is four hours, 12-4 PM and 6-10 PM. With a general admission ticket, you receive a tasting glass for unlimited 2-ounce tastings, music by local bands, educational sessions by industry experts and a festival program. General admission tickets are (prices will be announced at a later date) per session (day of event, prices will be announced at a later date, per session, if not sold out).

2012 Oct 15
Why on earth should they publish a financial statement!? No charitable receipts were given, Riverkeeper is, by all accounts, thrilled with the outcome, and the two people who seem to have their knickers in a knot either didn't go or stayed for only a short time. Jeebus, they don't owe you anything krusty. Comparing this to ticketed events is absurd.

Nice event Taralyn.

2012 Oct 15
There is a big difference between a charity and non profit event which we can agree on. If someone makes a claim that they are holding a non profit event and refuses to provide a financial statement, that leaves people suspect.

I had a business prof once who taught us the free lunch principle. There never is a free lunch. End of that lesson.

You are right, the event owes me nothing. But life has taught me that a lot or people make a lot of profit on so called non profit events.

2012 Oct 15
IIRC There is also a big legal distinction between non profit and not for profit, but a lawyer can answer this better than I. And have to admit I'm curious as to how much money was realized for Riverkeepers after all the investment and volunteer effort - just curious because I am involved in a few fundraising events and not always convinced that there is enough of a payoff to justify the investment and effort of so many volunteers. But in any case I think if we have more events of this kind in Ottawa, the competition will only improve the range of options.

2012 Oct 15
Great response Taralyn. Hope Johanna apologizes for some of her comments and mischaracterizations of you and your event.

2012 Oct 18
Sounded like a decent event.. Might have wondered down if I was in town.

But I was drinking champagne and wine, not beer that night.